RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 8:54 AM |
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Anyone come up with a solution or cause for CodeCharge's random shutdown? At random intervals, the app just disappears and crashes. It seems to happen most when a button is clicked such as starting a Builder wizard or attempting to insert a table to a page. I've tried different computers, different environments, nothing seems to make a difference. It is very frustrating because CodeCharge essentially becomes unusable. Sometimes rebooting the computer helps. Often times a complete removal of CodeCharge and reinstallation seems to help, for a while anyway.
When does CodeCharge crash on you?
What are you doing when it crashes?
What have you found helps prevent crashes?
Thanks!
I'm going to have to disagree Oper. 80% of CodeCharge users are not using illegal windows. If you read other forum entries, many use CCS to make a living. 80% of them are not using illegal software. Perhaps in your region that is true, but it is not universally true and nowhere near 80%. CodeCharge Crashes are a legitimate problem for professional users, and just because there are problems does not mean the individual having the problems is a reprobate with illegal software and mp3 downloaders installed. That is just rhetoric and not particularly helpful to an edifying discussion.
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mor
Posts: 119
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 9:00 AM |
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Quote RoyHobbs99223:
When does CodeCharge crash on you?
What are you doing when it crashes?
What have you found helps prevent crashes?
There were a 3-4 times after insert components\run wizards in Design Mode. In HTML mode works fine. For complex pages HTML mode - best way and I use it.
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 9:32 AM |
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True. For some reason launching wizards from HTML view seems to work better than launching from design view. But design view should work. What's the use of design view if it crashes the software.
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DataDoIT
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 9:36 AM |
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Roy, run this through support. Give them precise details of your
environment:
* EXACT CodeCharge version
* EXACT Windows version
* EXACT .Net version
* Your CCS language
* Windows app crash report when it does happen (if available)
* What was being done in CCS when it happened
This will not only help you and Yes Software, but everyone else that
currently uses CCS. Good luck - we're all counting on you! :)
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 10:04 AM |
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Hi DataDoIt.
Yes, good idea. My goal for this post is not to complain but to start a discussion that will benefit everyone. That said, support has not been overwhelmingly helpful on this issue. They suggest running the app as administrator or just do not respond intelligently.
I run:
1. most recent version of version 5
2. Windows 7 Pro x86 (tried x64 too w/ no change.)
3. CCS Language: ASP, ASP.NET C#, ASP.NET C# InMotion
So speak up Forum Folks - how has the crash problem affected you?
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 11:49 AM |
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Event Log:
Faulting application name: CodeChargeStudio5.exe, version: 5.0.0.0, time stamp: 0x4fbcde80
Faulting module name: ntdll.dll, version: 6.1.7601.17725, time stamp: 0x4ec49b8f
Exception code: 0xc0000374
Fault offset: 0x000ce6c3
Faulting process id: 0x544
Faulting application start time: 0x01cdb8476a7e4ed4
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files (x86)\CodeChargeStudio5\CodeChargeStudio5.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Windows\SysWOW64\ntdll.dll
Report Id: fb5f9dd2-243a-11e2-97df-0026b98e1a68
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DataDoIT
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 1:16 PM |
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My environment is PHP/MySQL, so can't help there. But I do have
periodic events where the app just closes (not crash, just closes) like
what you describe. I know exactly where and how they occur, and have
opened support tickets over the years. This is for v4.3. The answer on
all of them were they were [supposedly] addressed in v5.
Seeing how v5 doesn't appear to be any more stable than v4.3 at this
point six months into it's release, and based on many "issues" reported
here, I have not and will not upgrade anytime soon. I know exactly how
and where to crash CCS, and I prefer not to have to learn a whole new
set of workarounds.
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MichaelMcDonald
Posts: 640
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| Posted: 11/01/2012, 6:27 PM |
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I reckon a few of the issues stem from the dotnet framework and so can never be removed.
A common cause of an application closing is memory mismanagement.
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Central Coast, NSW, Australia.
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/02/2012, 10:01 AM |
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Good insight Michael. Please explain "memory mismanagement".
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laneoc
Posts: 154
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| Posted: 11/02/2012, 3:24 PM |
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I've opened support cases on this. Reply = "re-install and let us know the results".
Results = works for a couple days, then breaks again.
I went through this cycle about four times with them, then gave up. When it starts crashing a lot, I reinstall again.
I typically crashes whenever there is a complex operation. Executing a "Find in Files" will crash the system 95% of the time.
It also crashes due to structures it does not like in link parameters.
Each of these is a 5.0 problem, not 4.3.
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MichaelMcDonald
Posts: 640
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| Posted: 11/02/2012, 8:05 PM |
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Hi Roy,
When I was young, I used to smoke a lot of hooch. I could never remember where I put references to the outside world in my head. Also, the things I could remember I could not place into any logical storage sequence either and so the relationship between those things became broken, and so memorising them was a moot exercise as well.
This is the crux of it, Windows is managing memory and so has the final say on whether data being inserted into or retrieved from memory is valid. Codecharge may request a memory address or block for use and for all intents and purposes believe it has been allocated as such by the operating system. However, we have no way of seeing if a background process or a Windows kernel operation or such has other ideas about what the memory segment/s is to be used for. For the record even though DOTNET is a mostly MS construct we cannot even see if it has internal management conflicts with other MS operands. I could go on for hours about memory management but to do so would constitute an entire semester worth of dictation. So I am now going to present an easy to digest real world example concerning paging files: Say your memory (ram) fills up and windows decides to write the memory address and contents to hard disk for later retrieval and when it has done this clears the memory concerned for other use with the further intention of loading the memory address and contents back from the HDD into ram at a later time. Say now the block of the HDD the memory data gets written to is poor and does take the record of memory address properly, but does not quite take the memory contents properly. When the OS reloads this data from HDD back into memory, it takes the now corrupt memory contents from the HDD and attempts to insert it into ram, or worse the actual memory address itself became corrupted on the HDD and Windows tries to load that into a reserved memory address or one which is already in use, or one that does not exist - the latter can cause a memory leak and Windows shuts down the application requesting it to protect itself.
And this is probably what happens most of the time.
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Central Coast, NSW, Australia.
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MichaelMcDonald
Posts: 640
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| Posted: 11/02/2012, 8:36 PM |
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Roy I just read your crash file report and SysWOW64 I think is what is known as a "thunker" - the part of the operating system which handles translating 32-bit apps to 64 and vice-versa.
ntdll.dll is a core operating system component. If it is being paged to a bad sector of HDD then any part of my above post could apply.
Also, I note the faulting process id is : 0x544
After CCS crashes:
1. Go into task manager and select column view process id and see if 0x544 (or whatever code your next crash report gives) - and see if that process is still running. If it is, then Windows protected itself by shutting down CCS and the OS is most likely stable, but look at HDD condition and make sure all RAM modules are well matched. Contrary to popular opinion, they don't all line up with each other very well sometimes.
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Central Coast, NSW, Australia.
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/06/2012, 12:37 PM |
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Thanks MichaelMcDonald that is helpful. I have seen other applicaitons totally unrelated to CCS have difficulty in the SysWOW64 x86 --> x64 area and so I thought the same thing when I looked into it - although I did not know the specifics like you detail. Thanks again. However... the error report I posted was on a x64 box, but I run CCS on a Win7 x32 box regularly and get more problems than on the x64. So since I've tried it in both environments and get similar results, I figured it was likely a CCS issue more than an OS issue. It seems like the more you ask CCS to do, ie the more complex the tasks, the more likely it is to crash. Build a simple html site and it will run all day no problem. But try to edit a grid, or heaven forbid add an event or copy-paste something, use Find function or the like and CCS will crash. It seems like it should be something Yes could research, identify and fix if they wanted to - which is why I am here.
There is a solution to this problem... just need somebody to think it is a priority.
More comments please.
When does CCS crash on you? What are you doing when it happens? What results?
Thanks.
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bannedone
Posts: 273
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| Posted: 11/06/2012, 3:01 PM |
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LOL
I think we all are overthinking this thing. (Or maybe a little Hooch)
CCS has been like this always. We gotta learn to live with it.
In all likelyhood it will never be fixed by Yes.
Best solution is "save all" after almost every change.
And yes.. my experience has been that the more complex action performed the more likely a crash. Saving All frequently seems to reduce the risk of crashes and also prevents the losing of code. BTW. I have NEVER needed to uninstall & reinstall CCS to fix any issue and this has been 7 years.
Have fun
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John Real
CodeCharge Studio Support, Training, Consulting, Development, Web based solutions
http://realsites.biz
http://ccselite.com
Other Banned IDs on this Forum. jjrjr1, jjrjr2 |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/07/2012, 9:17 AM |
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Sure. I understand budget software is going to be buggy and there needs to be some adjusted expectations. But learning the nuances of a software and working around flaws is different than the application just shutting down spontaneously. An expectation that the fundamental stability of the application should be in place seems a reasonable request.
Name a specific function you have performed that caused CCS to crash?
Why should our expectations of Yes be so low?
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Oper
Posts: 1195
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| Posted: 11/07/2012, 1:18 PM |
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we have 4 Licensed People working for 6-8 Hours Daily (2 on CCS4.3 and 2 CCS5)
Not Crash at all in any of those computer.
But Those Computer are Security/Powered
(No Crack, No Peer Program, No Ilegal Software, No MP3/Movie Downloader,No Strange Java Script)
*ALSO NO ANTIVIRUS* (We are testing Bitdefender) Nither USB/CD
The only program are the one we use for develop
IIS and Database run in a Seperated Server.
The only computer i see crash and is like 1 or 2 a month is mine and thats maybe
cause i run lot of stuff at once IIS, NET App, etc.Database.
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Please do backup first |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/07/2012, 4:00 PM |
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Very helpful Oper. Thank you! Sounds like "less is more" when it comes to the environment running CCS. Very interesting about the AV as it makes sense that could be a culprit. Not sure about the other stuff you mention as I have no experience with those things.
What OS / SvcPack / etc. seems to work best?
Is RAM a factor?
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bannedone
Posts: 273
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| Posted: 11/07/2012, 4:43 PM |
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I agree with Oper....
As I have had my share of crashes in CCS.... It actually only happens on rare ocasions and I have ALOT of stuff running on my machine....
I do believe that saving frequently (Save All) reduces the occurrences of crashes.
This issue has existed for me since CCS 3
As program crashes go I also have had my share with Adobe Dreamweaver, Adobe Flash CS3, and a few other programs including Windows.
My environment:
I7, 8gig ram, 512gig SSD - Boot Drive (Partitioned as Dual Boot Win/Linux selectable using GRUB), Win 7 64bit/Ubuntu 12 32 bit. (Additional internal and Ext. USB/Network HDD to 10TB of Disk)..
LOL I know that might sound excessive but I do alot of video processing in addition to Software Development. CCS is my primary development tool
Loaded Programs at boot:
XAMPP, IIS, Outlook, Nod32 Anti Virus, AnyDVD, CoreTemp, Network Magic, Virtual Clone Drive, Magic ISO, Skype, MSN, and a few others I cannot remember.
That sort of illustrates a pretty busy box.. LOL
My guess is if CCS performs reasonably for me in this environment it is doing OK.
_________________
John Real
CodeCharge Studio Support, Training, Consulting, Development, Web based solutions
http://realsites.biz
http://ccselite.com
Other Banned IDs on this Forum. jjrjr1, jjrjr2 |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/12/2012, 3:50 PM |
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Design / Edit / Add a Table
<splat>
Faulting application name: CodeChargeStudio5.exe, version: 5.0.0.0, time stamp: 0x4fbcde80
Faulting module name: ntdll.dll, version: 6.1.7601.17725, time stamp: 0x4ec49b60
Exception code: 0xc0000374
Fault offset: 0x000c380b
Faulting process id: 0x12b4
Faulting application start time: 0x01cdc10d886ec4b7
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files\CodeChargeStudio5\CodeChargeStudio5.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll
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Oper
Posts: 1195
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| Posted: 11/12/2012, 4:36 PM |
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RoyHobbs99223,
Update CCS version
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http://www.7bz.com (Free CMS,CRM Developed in CCS)
http://www.PremiumWebTemplate.com
Affiliation Web Site Templates
Please do backup first |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/12/2012, 4:45 PM |
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Hi Oper,
Currently running version 5.0.0.16254 (best currently available).
Do not know why the error report says 5.0.0.0.
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/13/2012, 11:48 AM |
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When you rt-click on a column sorter and select Edit Sorter, there is a script error and CCS freezes.
Script Error: Permission Denied File:///C:/Program%20Files/CodeChargeStudio5/Components/Dialogues/Controls/Sorter/Sorter.html
This error occurs even if the windows user has local adminstrator permissions, but does not occur if CCS is run AS the local administrator.
After the error CCS becomes inoperable.
This would fit with Oper's post that when running CCS on a stripped down, simple, CCS only PC, CCS works without error.
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/14/2012, 1:02 PM |
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CCS v5 times out after being idle and when you return to it and try any function, it disappears. No error report in the Event Viewer. It looks like the disappearing issue, at least to some degree, is related to permissions. There are inconsisentcies in the way CCS uses OS security to function and when there is an unexpected denial, CCS disappears or crashes.
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bannedone
Posts: 273
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| Posted: 11/14/2012, 3:02 PM |
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This happens to me after long idle time but CCS just hangs for a few, does not dissapear.
CCS Need to be run as an Administrator on Win 7
BTW I have had the same issue with CCS 4.3
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John Real
CodeCharge Studio Support, Training, Consulting, Development, Web based solutions
http://realsites.biz
http://ccselite.com
Other Banned IDs on this Forum. jjrjr1, jjrjr2 |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 11/19/2012, 8:43 AM |
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Looking back at Oper's post about using CCS in an isolated solo environment is making more sense. I also found that when the YesSoftware servers are down and CodeCharge Studio cannot communicate with YesSoftware, that CodeCharge Studio functions better. Using CCS on a PC that has no internet connection (ironic one would use a web development tool on a computer with no internet connection) appears to help prevent CodeCharge from disappearing.
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acedrummond
Posts: 90
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| Posted: 12/03/2012, 5:33 PM |
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I have been using ver 5 for a couple of projects and have experienced the system just closing a few times with no indication of why. (environment Win 7 WAMP)
Now I have one very small brand new project with a very few pages each with a single grid each.
Every time I try to select in the builder the second table in a database it just shuts down!
After reading all the comments in this issue I installed the ver 5 software on another machine (environment Win 8 WAMP) and moved the project over to the new machine.
Now it works so there is something on my machine that Ver 5.0 does not like.
The one change I made over the weekend was to install ODBC 5.1 for 64 bit and I am wondering if that is the source of the problem.
Very frustrating because I really need to keep this development environment on my laptop and not on my desktop.
I am going to go ahead and remove the drivers and reinstall them. I may even go to Win 8 on the laptop too.
Will advise if I find out anything.//
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acedrummond
Posts: 90
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| Posted: 12/04/2012, 10:51 AM |
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What I 'think' I learned so far by comparing the one machine (WIN 8 Desktop) with the other (WIN 7 Laptop)
1. Admin of ODBC is controlled by 2 programs 1 for 64 bit and the other for 32 bit - I need to use the 32 bit and it resides in windows/sysWOW64 accessed as %windir%\sysWOW64\odbcad32.exe
This came to light as WIN 8 machine had both and my WIN 7 only the 64 bit version. So I confirmed this by some Google searches and indeed it is a bit counter intuitive.
So now both are available on my WIN 7 laptop and for good measure I deleted ALL of my ODBC entries in the admin tool and put them all in fresh with the known correct tool.
2. While making sure that all my new ODBC entries were configured correctly I inadvertently typed 'locilhost 'instead of 'localhost' this caused the CCS program to hang and then abort while trying to set up a connection. So it is not very tolerant of errors in ODBC set up.
3. The other thing I experienced a few times is having the CCS program quit if I used a \grid builder, but did not go through every screen and just selected a table with all fields on screen and immediately went to Finish on the builder CCS would quit!
It is certainly not fun and a great time consuming thing to deal with these issues ongoing.
The best advice is as stated earlier SAVE OFTEN.
I think it would help if others discover similar issues if we put them here so that we collectivly learn something and maybe YES will too!
Thanks//
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Ace Drummond |
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RoyHobbs99223
Posts: 37
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| Posted: 12/04/2012, 6:04 PM |
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Thanks acedrummond for posting this information here - it will be helpful! Good information about the ODBC driver and the 32-64bit driver issues. I have frequently had similar issues with CCS disappearing when using a builder and either not going through all the steps or going back a step or two then trying to progress forward again. Also have found (thanks to this dialogue) that once CCS quits during a function, for example adding a table to a page, then it when it is restarted, it quits repeatedly anytime any function is attempted. To get around this I have found that opening the page in HTML mode, and not Design mode, then entering the table or other funciton from HTML instead of design, CCS will think for a long time but eventually perform the task correctly. And after that it will not disappear again (for a while anyway). I have found that if you do exactly what CCS wants, it will cooperate, if you go out of sequence or do something unusual it dies. One almost has to memorize the sequence of mouse clicks and steps to performing a task successfully and then only do it that way so as to keep it alive.
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MichaelMcDonald
Posts: 640
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| Posted: 12/04/2012, 11:18 PM |
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memory issues?
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Central Coast, NSW, Australia.
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acedrummond
Posts: 90
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| Posted: 12/05/2012, 1:30 PM |
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I keep plugging away at the issue of ccs shutting down.
I have one project I can repeat the problem over and over with which, in a sense is a good thing.
A table named jnet_temp_participants keeps aborting ccs every time I try to use with any builder.
I rebuilt the structure, removed the data, copied the structure from another table that works with same structure etc.
I even built a grid with another table name that has the same structure and was able to change the table in use with properties and the grid functions with the offending table.
I got rid of my complete WAMP install and re-installed from scratch, reloaded databases that work from another host too!
Problem persists.
After trying so many combinations and permutations I shortened the offending table name form jnet_temp_participants to jnet_testp and it now lets the builder run.
Frustrating to say the least, but at least I can repeat the problems over and over.
I've opened a case with support. In the mean time I have a work around at least.
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